Exactly their software is non-free: https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/redpine-firmware-nonfree
The problem with PureOS is: It is a marketing-move and the FSF has gone willing with it. Did they know? Well, unclear until today. Nevertheless Puism is not doing anything "ethical" as this is just their point of sale and marketing. Nothing more: They tell something with buzzwords around their devices. In fact those devices are not that bad for sure, but also not that good as they promised.

I wonder to myself if Purism is the type of company that if they thought they could get away with it, they would remove all blobs, but neglect to mention to their customers that the hardware couldn't boot because of this.

By get away with it, I mean legally...

I know very little about Purism, but as with "green" or "carbon neutral" or "fair trade", "open source" has become a marketing thing for selling products. By it's very nature, hardware is a tangible product which is developed and sold for profit, and it's why I'm convinced that open hardware is a long way off, only a utopian fantasy at this point.  In my view it will only ever be a reality if there is some regulation in place. Right now at this moment in time, that seems like a pipe dream.

Until then, almost everything that makes claims of "privacy", "open source", "free", etc - and which is operated for profit - should be treated with some scepticism.

For example, Raspberry Pi was a wonderful thing for many, it was aimed at education, low cost, designed to work with Linux and most never considered Broadcom's involvement and proprietary firmware. People often see things through a very narrow lens and those marketing such products can exploit that, to focus on a few key aspects of "freedom" while ignoring many other key areas.

Ironically, a lot of hardware has climate friendly pledge that is so far from it.

The moment any hardware has backdoors and data collection done regularly, that status should be revoked automatically, because it is wasting electricity and likely to end up in a landfill due to security issues and is a hog already.

This can be applied to all hardware that does this when the climate is already in trouble...

I mean for God's sake, are they trying to kill the planet as fast as possible?

What good does money do these people, if the planet gets to a point where people die because of this greed?

Its like spending a bunch of money on a special type of oil to run a car, but your car is likely going to die in a few days.

Utterly stupid... but this is many times stupider.

Until then, almost everything that makes claims of "privacy", "open source", "free", etc - and which is operated for profit - should be treated with some scepticism.

For example, Raspberry Pi was a wonderful thing for many, it was aimed at education, low cost, designed to work with Linux and most never considered Broadcom's involvement and proprietary firmware. People often see things through a very narrow lens and those marketing such products can exploit that, to focus on a few key aspects of "freedom" while ignoring many other key areas.

The story of Purism and the Librem 5 is not told to the end: https://puri.sm/posts/where-is-my-librem-5-part-3/
Just to mention the table showing the state:

Model: Librem 5
Status: Currently shipping backlogs
Lead Time: 52 weeks

There are enough reports that Purism is not telling the customers the full story as they have not reached parity for delivering the devices. They always told about the certification for FCC. A company like Purism being oriented on ethical handle should know better instead they do shady tales.

Geez... sonds like the OWRL campaign on crowdsupply which I found out, still is there later on.

Basically, OWRL is a physically secure device or so they say. The problem is, the firmware they develop has a huge limitation. Its proprietary!

Anywho, the only thing I think librem has done that is even a little bit palatable is that they gave some money to help develop a libre lightweight openpower processor. Libre-Soc aka...

But yeah, this doesn't make them innocent at all, possilbly that was their way to divert attention just like google has done in the past.

Luke seemed to indicate that even Purism's own OS isn't even libre.  Which I am unsure of, but at best its as bad as another well known one that swallows all the corporate garbage that is thrown to the mainstream distros. At worst, its also a liar on blobs that are obvious too.

This all being said, I give 1 point for the one good thing I mentioned and -99 for everything else.  Difference of -100 and -99, isn't very great...

OWRL is the -100.

Btw, 52 weeks isn't that a year? LOL!

That sounds like eoma68 style waiting, but without any ethical intentions at all!

As a last added note, the pocket mnt reform wait time if you ordered last tuesday is october 17th. I think? That is akin to seven months I think.

But for purism, they are A:

Not pure

B:

not honest

C:

Lying even on their libre os

D:

5 months longer wait, but I don't know how long that was true either.

Model: Librem 5
Status: Currently shipping backlogs
Lead Time: 52 weeks

There are enough reports that Purism is not telling the customers the full story as they have not reached parity for delivering the devices. They always told about the certification for FCC. A company like Purism being oriented on ethical handle should know better instead they do shady tales.

Abuse of power is a very complex thing and topic: Everyone could do that, some even about the imagination to do no further harm towards others. Is it good or bad? As you have said: Depends on definition. But the point I'm onto is shortened criticism. Therefore the thread is named especially the way it is: A sad story. Because for sure it is one. Purism could do better and perhaps someone is reading here or somewhere else, thinks and gets something back to do that? Perhaps nothing happens or something else. The point is: Yes, we should name problems and write down criticism. We should also stay true towards principles: Meaning there is no need to use services from named companies or their platforms. Do a change with little steps, that's the idea behind.

Lithium generally is not good as being toxic waste in the end. There are works out there to use alternatives, but for now they are not finished and let us hope they are getting better for our environment. As said that: I think MNT should do further on their way. But nevertheless I stay also at the point mentioned: Free hardware needs to be affordable. Best model is to use refurbished hardware in that case.

But one annotation onto MNT Reform also ... if you want to write about that, create a new topic. It is kind of complicated for people to follow any topic if there is mixed content without any relation to the discussion. Thanks!

Fair point, I was more just saying, they at least mean well...

Will open a new one right now though!

Sorry bout that lol

Lithium generally is not good as being toxic waste in the end. There are works out there to use alternatives, but for now they are not finished and let us hope they are getting better for our environment. As said that: I think MNT should do further on their way. But nevertheless I stay also at the point mentioned: Free hardware needs to be affordable. Best model is to use refurbished hardware in that case.

But one annotation onto MNT Reform also ... if you want to write about that, create a new topic. It is kind of complicated for people to follow any topic if there is mixed content without any relation to the discussion. Thanks!

Yes, for sure a valid point. The reasoning for this thread is more about the promises Purism has done in the past and the marketing they use for telling about "full freedom". Personally I would be more okay with clear wordings like "more oriented towards freedom" or something else. I deal myself also at working time with enough non-free software so I know the compromises being made. But especially throughout those compromises we see more problems around in the free culture and free soft- / hardware. People seem to more okay with them instead of having a clear understanding about so phrases like "open-source" are mixed into places where this could not be even more far away from reality.

Nobody gets taken away the freedom to choose for sure. But we can see more and more parts vanishing as more compromises are made on the course. A mentioned "evil" is nowhere to be found as that harsh description should be avoided. In fact I would no company name "evil" (per definition), just ignorant. The point is: Do we choose using them as only possible way? Or do we try something else? That is our choice to be made. So we need information being shared and discussions being done. Not about "evil", just about the methods and the facts behind.

You mean like how the linux foundation is being beyond stupid and supporting the idea of UEFI rather than being firm and saying we refuse to accept microsoft has to get approval for us to be able to install on UEFI?

Correcting the above quote, to make sure it makes sense...

As for the idea of no company being evil, let alone no corporation being evil... it depends on your definition of evil.

The moment someone abuses their power to control the user of their hardware or software, evil has already begun. 

Btw, I know your thoughts on mnt reform, so I am curious how you feel about this:

Not sure about all the changes made from i.MX8MQ VS LS1028A

This was the original right?

    CPU: NXP/Freescale i.MX8MQ with 4x ARM Cortex-A53 cores (1.5 GHz), 1x Cortex-M4F core. CPU and RAM are on exchangeable SO-DIMM sized module.
    RAM: 4 GB LPDDR4 memory
    GPU: Vivante GC7000Lite GPU with mainline Linux drivers and OpenGL 2.1, ES 2.0
    Display: Full HD (1920x1080 pixels) 12.5" IPS eDP display driven via MIPI-DSI. Optionally-enabled HDMI port. 128 x 32 pixel system control OLED
    USB: 3x USB 3.0 ports external (Type-A), 2x USB 2.0 internal (for input devices)
    Networking: Gigabit Ethernet port. miniPCIe Wi-Fi card included in Reform Max pledge level.
    Storage: Internal M.2 M-key socket for NVMe SSD. Full size SD card slot.
    PCIe: 1x miniPCIe socket (PCIe 2.0 1x), 1x M.2/NGFF socket M-key (PCIe 2.0 1x)
    Keyboard: Reform mechanical USB keyboard with Kailh Choc Brown Switches, dimmable backlight, open firmware
    Trackball (Option): Reform optical USB trackball with 5 mechanical switches (Kailh Choc Brown), open firmware
    Trackpad (Option): Reform capacitive USB trackpad, open firmware
    Enclosure: Modular case from CNC-milled, bead-blasted, black-anodized 6061 aluminum. Bottom cover milled from semi-transparent acrylic.
    Sound: Wolfson WM8960 ADC/DAC, stereo speakers, 3.5" headset/microphone jack (no internal microphone)
    Camera: No camera. Internal MIPI-CSI connector
    Battery: LiFePO4 battery technology - which is more fire-safe and has more charge-cycles than LiPo battieries. 8x owner-serviceable 18650 cells totalling 12 Ah/3.2 V. 5 h approximate battery life
    System Controller: NXP LPC11U24 ARM Cortex-M0 chip with open firmware and hackable expansion port
    Manual: Operator Manual incl. system schematics and full parts list
    Sources: KiCAD sources for motherboard, keyboard, trackball, trackpad, STEP/STL/FreeCAD files for case parts, C sources for all firmware (input devices and system controller), build scripts for boot & system image
    OS: Preloaded with Debian GNU/Linux 11, Linux 5.x mainline kernel
    Dimensions: 29 x 20.5 x 4 cm
    Weight: ~1.9 kg

Also, look up the differences between LiFePO4 vs Lithium Ion

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-i … ery#Safety
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-i … tal_impact
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-i … hts_impact

Then look at LiFePO4:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_i … advantages

Aka, the original mnt reform uses that type.

Hopefully the pocket one will also have that option in the future.

I initially wanted a 24 hour battery, but I am now thinking, that its better to have the same amount of LiFePO4 batteries in the mini as an expansion option instead, even if it only gives 12 hours.

That being said, your concerns are reasonable, provided no better alternative comes around.

Hopefully something better does come though.

Btw, modular can be better, even if people toss the old version of it out, if and only if, the components it uses are less than 1/8th of the toxicity level of the alternatives.

Which more than likely will be the case in the future if not now.

Nobody gets taken away the freedom to choose for sure. But we can see more and more parts vanishing as more compromises are made on the course. A mentioned "evil" is nowhere to be found as that harsh description should be avoided. In fact I would no company name "evil" (per definition), just ignorant. The point is: Do we choose using them as only possible way? Or do we try something else? That is our choice to be made. So we need information being shared and discussions being done. Not about "evil", just about the methods and the facts behind.

Yes, but there is this little thought within me that there could be other ways to come. Meaning Purism rethinking their approach. Having coreboot-systems being released in form of the source-code for the final rom-binaries for newer x86 / x86_64 generations? Not that bad. But as said: That's just this little thought within. Not really more, but also not less.

To be honest, its hard to say, if they would make all their hardware open source licensed, even if they could. Which of course, is on a DRM level, even, completely impossible.

Not only would that be expensive,  but, given their ways, its hard to say if even then, it would be worth it.

If I plan to buy an expensive laptop, like that, I want it to be three things at the minimum:

modular
optionally DRM-Free
low electricity usage

Beyond that, I might as well get an old thinkpad from the ivybridge with intel me disabled and coreboot installed.