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Topic: PINE64: Another sad story around power and control

Hey, I was thinking if this newer created thread should even exist or not. Nevertheless: The news about PINE64, the PinePhone (Pro) and Manjaro is absolutely on the point describing many problems we have nowadays even with once free projects. A story also around power and control. But well? Everyone is here to read: https://blog.brixit.nl/why-i-left-pine64/

And to quote:

(...)
But the Pinebook Pro has a similar boot configuration, and thus a similar problem. Some time after the PinePhone Pro was shipped, it was time for a new Pinebook Pro batch, and this discussion started again. The same arguments were re-iterated by all sides all over again, and the discussion went nowhere. PINE64 representatives went so far as to say, quote, "people who want [an SPI chip] can just solder one on". This batch of Pinebook Pros has ended up shipping without Tow-Boot flashed.
(...)
This is the moment I left. I left all the official channels, stepped down as PINE64 moderator. Left the private developer chat rooms. PINE64 cares only about Manjaro, and Manjaro does not care about working with any other distributions. This is no longer a community that listens to software developers. As a representative of postmarketOS, there is no further reason for me to be directly involved with PINE64 if the only opinions that matter are those of Manjaro.
(...)

It is also the end of another illusion: PINE64 being onto supporting a good example of different software-communities working together,  supporting many distributions working together on each of the many facets of the software required. Yes, people: In the end, it is also about pure money. And money decides so there is only one mono-culture. We have many examples about that while people tell many many tales. In fact all of them illusions. Yes, PINE64 did good into supporting different parts and getting living community-editions of many systems with different aspects. But now the decisions show another side of the story to end. That is why corporate open-source won't persist and why we need free and libre systems and a functional software-ecosystem, free and libre culture with the major interest for technical emancipation. And I hope the systems around will support and work further, even without PINE64. A sad story for sure! sad

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

2 (edited by zapper 2022-08-27 03:51:32)

Re: PINE64: Another sad story around power and control

throgh wrote:

Hey, I was thinking if this newer created thread should even exist or not. Nevertheless: The news about PINE64, the PinePhone (Pro) and Manjaro is absolutely on the point describing many problems we have nowadays even with once free projects. A story also around power and control. But well? Everyone is here to read: https://blog.brixit.nl/why-i-left-pine64/

And to quote:

(...)
But the Pinebook Pro has a similar boot configuration, and thus a similar problem. Some time after the PinePhone Pro was shipped, it was time for a new Pinebook Pro batch, and this discussion started again. The same arguments were re-iterated by all sides all over again, and the discussion went nowhere. PINE64 representatives went so far as to say, quote, "people who want [an SPI chip] can just solder one on". This batch of Pinebook Pros has ended up shipping without Tow-Boot flashed.
(...)
This is the moment I left. I left all the official channels, stepped down as PINE64 moderator. Left the private developer chat rooms. PINE64 cares only about Manjaro, and Manjaro does not care about working with any other distributions. This is no longer a community that listens to software developers. As a representative of postmarketOS, there is no further reason for me to be directly involved with PINE64 if the only opinions that matter are those of Manjaro.
(...)

It is also the end of another illusion: PINE64 being onto supporting a good example of different software-communities working together,  supporting many distributions working together on each of the many facets of the software required. Yes, people: In the end, it is also about pure money. And money decides so there is only one mono-culture. We have many examples about that while people tell many many tales. In fact all of them illusions. Yes, PINE64 did good into supporting different parts and getting living community-editions of many systems with different aspects. But now the decisions show another side of the story to end. That is why corporate open-source won't persist and why we need free and libre systems and a functional software-ecosystem, free and libre culture with the major interest for technical emancipation. And I hope the systems around will support and work further, even without PINE64. A sad story for sure! sad

Hmm... well thanks for this bit of info...

Thats one developer for arm devices that I guess I have to scratch off the list forever...

I wasn't planning to do much, but it is still kind of sad...

Reason of why I had interest, is due to time and yes I would still want mnt reform anyhow.

But thank you, for letting me know that they aren't much better than Purism.

-5 (purism)   (PINE64) -3.5

Better, but not by anything worthwhile it seems...



Meh...

I guess thats how the cookie crumbles.

At least the MNT Reform team actually gives a damn about its supporters.

They definitely charge more, though... so it would be cruel and awful if they didn't care.

That being said,  if ARM was the main goal of  MNT Reform, I don't think people would have interest in it for very long.

But their crowdfunding is soon nearby...

This is semi related due to this also using arm64 mostly for now.

LS1028A is the module you would want though as have said... many times.

Btw, do you consider the pine crew as bad as purism or not much better?

Probably irrelevant, but wondered.

HyperbolaBSD: The Future of Secure Libre Lightweight Operating Systems!

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Re: PINE64: Another sad story around power and control

I don't compare much between named teams. smile Personally I understand even some parts of the problem and moves PINE64 has done, but the execution is for sure more than questionable and the outcoming damage is also bad. But as said: I don't rely much into companies as I just make one point ... I just don't give any kind of trust into any of those. So I'm not that frustrated in the end. I will stay oriented onto used and refurbished devices, no interest in newer ones and also no interest into any kind of newer architecture for now. Community counts, people for sure, companies don't count for me and I'm not eager to help any of them. Furthermore companies doing that kind of moves won't receive any kind of support from me, but I'm sure they don't need it either. Damage was done for sure and we are dealing just with smoke and illusions. Even more frustrating: Only "profit" counts while the resulting damage is beyond repair.

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: PINE64: Another sad story around power and control

@throgh probably wise, whether it is PINE64, purism, etc...

If the people behind said project are untrustworthy then nothing good will come of it.

newer architectures however,  should give you interest, aka, don't ignore them, if you have trust issues with them, I understand completely, but always have them in your rear view mirror.

I mean, in  case things change for the better. Waiting is wise though.

HyperbolaBSD: The Future of Secure Libre Lightweight Operating Systems!

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Re: PINE64: Another sad story around power and control

For sure having an eye on the technologies, but that said: When I read about unfree firmware-blobs and booting issues without them, well I tend to sort them into the background for now - not giving up. wink

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: PINE64: Another sad story around power and control

throgh wrote:

For sure having an eye on the technologies, but that said: When I read about unfree firmware-blobs and booting issues without them, well I tend to sort them into the background for now - not giving up. wink

Yeah, that is fair I suppose...

From what I read, the only issue of the MNT Reform with LS1028A, is if you wanted 3D Video Acceleration.

Not sure the difference in speed between 3d and 2d, so meh...

Not completely sure what to say lol.

HyperbolaBSD: The Future of Secure Libre Lightweight Operating Systems!