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Topic: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Hello,

I am a new Hyperbola GNU/Linux-libre user and want to share my first general impressions I had when installing and attempting to use the system. Since this also involves the system in general I think this forum section should be appropriate.
To start off I think it is fitting to say why I am here.
I currently am mostly a Devuan GNU/Linux user, but I am getting more and more dissatisfied with how Debian (and as a result Devuan) is evolving, so I am always on the search for alternative distros/solutions. From what I have read Hyperbola seems very fitting for me, in particular due to the omission of a lot of bloated (and somehow trendy?) software. In particular I despise freedom issues due to trademarks and the constant breaking of software due to (what seems to me) unnecessary updates and due to centralized rolling-release package managers/repositories like pip and npm.
This is why I installed Hyperbola GNU/Linux-libre on one of my laptops that seems to fully support it.

I already knew about Hyperbola for quite some time now and always appreciated the focus on freedom but I never really wanted to go anywhere near it, since I always associated it with rolling-release (Which I now learned it isn't) and I didn't want to either lose the functionality to install software or deal with something breaking (in what feels like) every week.
I have already used icedove-uxp (on Devuan, locally built) before, which was what got me to know about Hyperbola in the first place, but I switched back to claws-mail.

First of, some things I am slightly annoyed by:
I dislike the network interface naming scheme - I'd much rather have the classic ethX and wlanX names. I know I can probably change this somewhere, but I mostly don't care, so I didn't check.
Slim (the graphical display manager) uses about 15 MiB of memory even after logging in. When I use startx I don't have this issue. Since the laptop I installed the system on only has 256M of memory, this does make a difference to me.

Due to the limited amount of memory on the device I am trying out Hyperbola on, I also had to install from a different device by swapping the harddrive.

A major issue for me is however the absence of bluetooth support. I have briefly checked the forum for this and from what I understand this is mainly because of bluez depending on dbus. I would be really interested in using Hyperbola on my more modern Tablet PC, but I also want to use my bluetooth keyboard which is obviously not possible. Is there any hope of bluetooth ever working on Hyperbola again (obviously without a dbus dependency) or am I stuck with a different system on my newer devices. Or is Hyperbola completely against adding bluetooth support (I read the wiki article but I didn't really understand, and I personally don't care about those kinds of security issues that much, I just want more freedom on my devices). If Hyperbola is not completely against re-adding bluetooth support, is there any way to help?

Though while I have some hope that Hyperbola GNU/Linux-libre will run on some of my newer devices, I highly doubt that HyperbolaBSD will (once it exists, at least at first). I guess I will just have to try then.

I had a problem that my trackpad was in absolute mode. I switched the driver to synaptics now and my trackpad works. However while doing this I tried to use

Xorg :0 -configure

(as instructed to on https://wiki.hyperbola.info/doku.php?id … s:xenocara) to create a auto-generated xorg.conf but it failed for me and said unrecognized option.
May just be my opinion, but I sometimes found the wiki to seem very incomplete.

I also have an issue with shutting down. When I shut down with

shutdown now

the shutdown hangs after saving the system clock for me. Shutting down with

openrc-shutdown -p now

works. Did I forget to do something while installing or is this intended.

Now one of my other main issues is, I'm currently terribly unhappy with the state of free software. This is not related to the system in any way, so perhaps it is not fitting here, but are there any recommendations for where to (preferably locally) meet other people also promoting free software in Hyperbola's sense or contributing to Hyperbola.

On the Emulators page on the wiki it also states that Hyperbola's goal in including emulators is to encourage it's users to develop free software for running in them. Does Hyperbola also provide a place for it's users to develop and share free software or games like this or are there any recommendations where to get or contribute such software.

Sorry for the long ramble, I just want to contribute to ensuring software freedom and compatibility in some way, which is why I installed Hyperbola on my old laptop so I at least have one machine which runs truly free software.

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Hello and thanks for sharing your impressions. So first I'd like to address the most biggest points, if you are okay with that. I would go through more with you and others interested also in the unfolding process of this thread and communication. Let's start:

1. The point of bluetooth is wide more complicated and at a point I fear to only say that Hyperbola is for sure "against it in some way". Reasoning for this: There is no community-oriented implementation of "bluetooth" itself. So there is no project besides bluez and we don't and won't reimplement this at any point out of the security-reasons but also about the missing community-focus. Hyperbolas main focus is and will be to use community-oriented software. Projects done by people for people under free, permissive licensing. Bluez is not following this as it is was initially implemented by Qualcomm, with the main focus on Linux itself. And there is the last but also important reason: We do not implement Linux-only interfaces as Hyperbola is in migration towards BSD. I list the points again:

- security issues
- Linux-only focus for bluez (no further need to package this for HyperbolaBSD)
- dbus-inclusion
- no community-efforts within the grounds of the project (only to mention as with this we would have in that region also cups to mention)

2. Slim and the memory-consumption is a point surely interesting and also correct to review. But you have not to use slim as display-manager and choose from others possible alike xorg-xdm - please also beware that you need to configure your window- / desktop-environment under the file rooted in /etc/conf.d when using xdm. Or you have a look into console-tdm. Also to mention is that we are in the process for adding even smaller windomanagers for systems alike oroborus or aewm++. In latest tests from last days I can report that with oroborus there is only 110 MB memory-usage (including slim) after a start with a complete environment. Nevertheless results may vary based on what is loaded and in usage.

3. About the way to shotdown: I would recommend you to add your local user-profile into the group "power".

usermod -aG power [USERNAME]

With this you are capable to do the following - for openrc and runit, including also future init-systems possible:

doas poweroff

(for turning off your system)

doas reboot

(for rebooting your system)

With the package zzz also possible:

doas zzz

(for getting your system into standby)

I hope I could answer your first questions with those. smile

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

3 (edited by Curoh 2023-10-17 17:56:27)

Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Thanks for the answer.

1. I was mostly aware of the issues with bluez and of the migration. I didn't know it was implemented by Qualcomm, I just thought it was a normal project. That makes it more clear.

EDIT: Please excuse my previous attitude. I have read a little bit about bluetooth and now have a better understanding of what you are saying. I know that you don't have any interest in implementing it. I'm definitely interested in using Hyperbola, just a little annoyed that I'm not able to use any newer Hardware for it. My newer devices unfortunately require non-free firmware loading for WiFi and bluetooth too, so I wouldn't be able to use it anyway. Now I'm stuck again. At least Hyperbola runs great on my old laptop. This is currently troubling me. I have a choice on whether I want to be able to use my newer hardware and live with some non-free firmware and tons of software bloat (With a different distro) or use my older hardware and actually have a proper operating system (With Hyperbola). Since I do not plan to get rid of any of my hardware, I guess I'll just run Hyperbola where it runs properly, and for now keep my other installations as they are. EDIT
I was not asking for bluez. I mainly wanted to ask if, after Hyperbola has migrated to BSD, bluetooth could be re-added, since most of the BSDs also seem to support it with a different software stack. I don't really know anything about BSD so I was just asking. I was also not asking about transferring files, contacts or audio or anything like that over bluetooth (what I understand to be the primary security concerns from the wiki page). I was only asking about basic HID support (I would assume that a wireless keyboard without bluetooth is probably just as insecure). Please don't take this offensively, I just would like to use the hardware my devices already have. I can understand that some security issues exist, but I don't see how they would (for example) harm me when I connect a wireless bluetooth game controller to my computer to play a game at home.
I was also asking that, if a community-oriented bluetooth software stack ever appeared, whether Hyperbola would consider it's inclusion or not.


(I should also mention that I'm the type of person to just set up auto login on my portable devices, because I normally trust the people around me to mostly have some common sense (and to not misuse it), I personally don't see it as a huge danger, especially since I normally don't lend my devices to anyone else. I do understand that it is different for some people though. I only encrypt files (using encfs) that I don't want anyone else to see on my local machine. I'm much more scared of some entities amassing huge amounts of data.)

2. Thanks for mentioning console-tdm, I already considered writing a similar simple shell script myself to auto run on login.
For a window manager I currently use awesome because of how easy it is to customize. I will take a look at oroborus or aewm++.

3. Thanks for telling me. I always used sudo/sudoers on Devuan for things like that anyways, so I would have checked doas for doing it as a normal user.

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Regarding bluetooth: That will be a part of the future when we go further implementing compatible code for HyperBK (as our kernel). The main focus stays first to get the system running and most other parts also. Especially because the port for GCC 8 was done but needs more review for the moment. smile

Sure, if there is a community-approach ... we look into it. Another problem of the current bluetooth-stack is also that only newest hardware get more security-implementation. Older devices? Not really. sad

For handling opendoas a proposal of group-memberships:

video
audio
sys
storage
optical
network
input
games
wheel

Also recommended at first group "users". smile
Especially because this is a bit different handled on Debian-alike systems and derivates, in some way.

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

I'm really happy to hear your response about bluetooth support. It makes me place way more trust in the system/team since the term "security" is misused so often to reduce the users amount of freedom. (And because I never know whether security issues even affect me or are just an excuse to tell people to buy new hardware.)

I've just set up the rest of my system and installed the software I usually use.
I've added myself to most of the groups except for the wheel, input, storage, sys and network groups. I know what wheel and input are for (Just don't need these permissions) but what do storage, sys and network do exactly. (I usually only care when I don't have the necessary permissions for something, so I don't really know.)

I'm now writing this from my new installation using netsurf. (Don't think there is any point in trying UXP browsers with under a hundred mb of memory available.)
I probably should also consider switching to a different window manager, awesome seems to use way too much memory (33 mb on my system). But I'll keep it for now.
Unfortunately I can't seem to paste any text with middle click inside netsurf and I also can't select text using the keyboard. I'll check that later.

Also still need to find a proper IDE to run on my installation. I normally use codeblocks but it also needs huge amounts of memory. I tried emacs and it seems to work but it shows a pure space overflow warning (I've searched the forum and haven't found anything about it).

(This laptop is now pretty usable for me with this setup. It makes to mad to always see so much software that just wastes tons of system resources because "modern" system have more of them.)

Thank you for the extensive support with setting up the system. Do you mind still answering my last few (more unrelated) questions or should I ask them somewhere else?

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Starting with the lightest one: Sure ask what you need and we can decide where to place this together. Hyperbola is organized as community-project and we decide together with proposals and for packages with tests.

This brings me towards to the groups (indirect question): The wheel group is mostly used for opendoas in comparison towards the sudoers-configuration. So when you add yourself to this group you are allowed direct to execute most root-privileged actions alike (example to follow):

doas pacman -Syu

For generic updating.

doas pacman -Syyu

For update with a complete refresh of your local repository-database.

doas pacman -S [PACKAGE]

For installation of packages.

Sure you can organize this way more variable and different as Hyperbola wants to offer most freedom to the users. This is what meant with "technical emancipation" as you are in command of your system! This brings now the question for sys, storage and network: The first two are for more access into the devices (same for input) as sometimes you may want to perhaps to do some tasks within besides mounting, especially also adding some specialized fuse-drivers. The last one is per default used for network-management with dhcpcd later on, if you wish to do so (therefore I add this most when giving tipps).

Mentioning the group "input" for example: As my personal favor is the emulation also for older gaming-systems alike I want sometimes to use USB-gamepads being accessible with mednafen and therefore using antimicrox with this (both part here in our repositories).

This brins now to your last and perhaps important question this time: The window-manager. Sorry to do this now, I know it is not kind to ask a question in return to another question asked before: What is your favorite way to act with your desktop-environment? Floating or tiling? Floating window-managers offer in return the way to place the window whereever you like. Tiling is the opposite but also more logical aligned.

We have reworked and added even some more window-managers in the last commits, but we have also many around. When you prefer floating-environments and this way most with saving memory I would first try jwm. For tiling there would be i3wm. But there are others like evilwm or pekwm going even smaller alike jwm. This comes for a price as they in return have to be enhanced by you with a panel for example. For this you can use fbpanel or tint2.

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Thanks for telling me about the uses for the storage and input groups. I used sshfs earlier to copy over some files and had to load the fuse module, I understand that that would then be automatic.
I usually use floating window managers. I tried jwm, evilwm and fbpanel, but in the end I switched to fluxbox for now. (I previously used openbox and tint2 before I installed Hyperbola on this system, so I know about them.)

Just also experienced an issue similar to the one mentioned here: https://forums.hyperbola.info/viewtopic.php?id=901 . For me it happened trying to play an mp3 file and was not in the filter video module but rather in the demux_open module because of the pextrd instruction, which seems to be from SSE 4.1, which my CPU doesn't support. What is the best way to contribute to issues like this getting fixed? Would it be any help if I check what the issue is, or is it already fixed somewhere. (I installed from the latest install DVD so my system should be up to date, pacman -Syu reports there is nothing to do.)

Also like I asked in my first post, are there any recommendations on where to get (and/or share) free software ROMs (and source obviously) for use with emulators available in mednafen?

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

About the mplayer-issue: This is a point we cannot solve that easy for the moment as our dedicated build-server is using for sure a different CPU-commandset in comparison towards a Pentium 4 as opposite. This is common point therefore so I need to ask for support here as we do not have those systems in reach for testing.

Perhaps it would help if you try to compile the corresponding mplayer-version here from the repositories local and try to patch the pextrd-instruction itself - meaning the check for it, so a lower SSE-instructionset could be used.

Around free software ROMs: This is quite a bit more difficult. The scene of free and libre gaming only exists under the grant to be ignored foremost as not being in "competition" with non-free gaming-scenes. So there are from my knowledge some ROM-deconstruction communities and reworks around as alike freedoom or blasphemer (also both in the Hyperbola-repositories if you have interests) but most of them are really not common supported so only small teams and groups. Others (speaking of the scene of free and libre games in general) are trying to get more known with releasing on non-free platforms, which is the same of a problem as free, libre software is carried on places where it has nothing to bother with foremost as it is about free software and free society, not the opposite.

In this current moment I could give some links, but most of them are already also in the repositories of Hyperbola as we try to collect what is possible for us to carry on as free culture also. For the mentioned issue: I would be happy to include a patch to solve this issue for sure. smile

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

9 (edited by Curoh 2023-10-18 14:36:40)

Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Concerning mplayer:
Is there a reason the --enable-runtime-cpudetection option isn't enabled in the PKGBUILD? According to DOCS/tech/binary-packaging.txt in the mplayer source it should be enabled when packaging, since it enables CPU detection at runtime rather than at compile time. Enabling this option fixes the issue for me. I personally believe that it should also be better since without it -mtune=native seems to be used and with it -mtune=generic seems to be used. The debian rules file also enables --enable-runtime-cpudetection .
EDIT: In case it wasn't clear I didn't build the package on my Intel Pentium 4 system but on a much newer system in a virtualized Hyperbola system that supports SSE 4.1 . it is broken for me without runtime detection, since it then resorts to compile time detection. I am currently assuming this option was misread when creating the package since it clearly says it is needed in the docs.

I still plan to reply the other answer concerning gaming later.

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

That would not help for solving this issue itself: So we would need to patch for sure for 32bit and 64bit.

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Why not? It is clearly intended like this. I don't really understand what you mean the issue is.
Without that option, mplayer will build for whatever capabilities the build machine has.
With that option, mplayer will include support for with and without, and will automatically decide by looking at the capabilities of the machine it is currently being run on.
At least that is how I understand it from reading the docs. Debian also has it like this. And it runs on my Pentium 4 without SSE 4.1 support like this.
Or does Hyperbola not want to optionally support instruction set extensions for people that have them? No offense whatsoever intended. I seem to understand the issue differently than you. Would you care to tell me how you understand it?

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

The problem is: The package is built generic for 32bit and 64bit on a dedicated server. smile
So I need to find a method including therefore the older architecture and including the newer up to the newest ... remember that all people download the same packages for their installed platform alike.

If I enumerate the used CPU-architecture and commands supported, we end again at this same point as the used CPU would support up to SSE4.1 for example. I hope this clears the problem a bit more. So I need to reduce the commandset for supporting also older architectures and solving that issue. This can be later used for HyperbolaBSD also when we as team build further.

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

13 (edited by Curoh 2023-10-18 18:52:11)

Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Yes this is exactly my point.

EDIT: If you don't believe me, just check mplayer's configure script (which is not auto generated and not from automake/autoconf). Runtime cpu detection is disabled by default (line 662). All the compile time support checks are only done if runtime cpu detection is disabled (check for example line 1942).

And this is also why I built the package on my way newer (64bit) AMD Ryzen 2 based machine. Building without that flag makes it fail on older systems (like my P4). Building with that flag makes it work on most systems (including my P4).
Since the PKGBUILD is missing that flag, the build scripts for mplayer autodetect that your server supports SSE 4.1 and the build only supports systems with SSE4.1 . If you add that flag the packages your server builds (regardless of what it itself supports), will also run on older and newer system alike.
This is how I understand it to work also from my own testing before. That adding the option changes mtune from native to generic also reinforces that this is how it is intended to me. (The file I mentioned (the packaging guidelines) also mentioned that this is a must, so you should probably enable it anyway, but this is beside the point.)

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Okay, so this parameter is different meant. I was going from the opposite point as it could be also could be read different depending on the perspective. Thanks for clearing. Sure I will add that parameter for the next buildout. smile

My fault therefore for misunderstanding the parameter. big_smile Thanks for clearing.

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Yes, thanks in advance for fixing mplayer when the next build comes. Runs great for me when built with that parameter (And I doubt it will introduce any other issues) but I'll probably still use mpv mostly. I mainly wanted to test it and I couldn't before.

I was also a little confused by the parameter name, especially since it didn't explicitly say that it disables compile time detection, so I just assumed so at first and tried it and checked later. Well at least I learned that not every configure file is from autoconf (I was searching for the autoconf input files until I decided to actually check the file itself).

Since I assume this also fixes the other topic I should have probably just posted there though. I've rarely used any forums before, so I don't really know the proper etiquette.


I still wanted to say something on the topic of free games which I asked about before in this thread. I know that there are few free/libre ROMs and similar things available for emulators, which is why I really liked the idea that was mentioned on the emulators page on the wiki here. So I was hoping to find a part of the community/users that actually follows this idea and tries to make free/libre ROMs like homebrew games for use in the free emulators for the older video game systems. Especially since emulators also sandbox the games in a way I assume most trust, so users wouldn't have as much security concerns when they just download a precompiled binary (Obviously source also needs to there, I know.) and play it.

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Absolutely, but there is nothing bad to be seen within learning together about more information and therefore also everything fine doing this here in the thread. My first approach was or would have been to search for the approval of the instructions and differences for SSE beyond SSE2 and remove (deactivate) it in the configuration-scripting. I have already added the new parameter local and only approve it on different systems now before doing another commit in the git-repositories.

About free, libre gaming and emulation: I have not found it again but there was once an interesting but very also serious article about why exactly is this working and also how near the end of this can be. So we all should now that only some little laws protect this and it is most only tolerated. The companies around would never tolerate when a free, libre game alike "supertux" would get even more attention then its non-free comparables. This is the same point why others quote they "love open-source". It is a nice masquerade. For sure: We need to preserve the classics. Even though I would even go further and state we need also to preserve their source-code, open and make it possible for everyone to rebuild old games, modify them and distribute them again. But there is again that fear mentioned before: Fear about loosing money and reputation at a point. I state that in general it is most no "evil intention", it is foremost ignorance thriving us humans. And so we will loose also works done, full with ideas and art to be preserved. Applications, libraries and games to mentioned within the same. It needs more time, but the question is: Do we have this time learning that there can be other approaches? Like within free, libre culture.

It is an interesting question, but I fear we do not have the time. So in the end: Better we stick what is there and do best we can. The other way around is again pretending something we should not do, ending in the same problematic points we have already. Hyperbola is made different from this is and therefore also strict with its own approach. Yes, perhaps people think we do not offer many packages, but we do what is possible. Therefore also a THANK YOU for your help within mplayer. smile

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Great to hear about you updating the package. I checked for a missing configuration option prior to actually trying to patch the scripting, since it obviously works for Debian and the package here is ported over from Debian (to my understanding). (Though I have to admit, I find Debian's packaging system far from user friendly and am constantly confused whenever I have to deal with it. I like Arch's PKGBUILDs way more and they're also the thing I missed most when I switched away from Arch years ago because of rolling release and systemd.)

I completely agree with the culture part. I am not talking about old non-free games (if that's what you mean by classics), since they are definitely non-free (And so called "romhacks" are also completely useless because of this). I also wish that they were more free but things are currently as they are unfortunately, which is why there needs to be way more focus and awareness on software freedom like other things are getting recently - I wish there were well known protests for software freedom in Hyperbola's sense, like there recently are against climate change and so on (As someone that grew up with activism for veganism). But unfortunately that doesn't seem to have as much attention (or I don't know about it). And I don't currently trust the FSF is helping much with it, because they constantly make compromises (to somehow use "free" software like firefox or chromium anyways), as I have already seen talked about on this forum. Just like that I can't use Jitsi Meet with any software I view as truly free and it also eats resources like crazy. Hyperbola is basically the only project I have ever seen that I consider to have sensible goals/ideals.

Interesting to see you mention supertux though. It is one of the projects I really used to love but I don't really like anymore. I still play it sometimes but only version 0.1.4 (0.1.3?) and 0.3.4 since I really dislike all newer versions and they are the only versions that feel (mostly) complete and playable (without crashes or anything) to me. And supertux really isn't something I can still support with the direction it is going with useless non-free features like Discord integration (I do care about my privacy) and with (in my opinion) worsening level-design, stability and graphics. (And also promoting Discord basically for everything). Which is kind of sad for me since I remember how much fun it was in my childhood (with 0.3.1 to 0.3.3, 0.1.3 and the weird 0.1.3 "mods" / level packs). Probably because of change of developers. These games also have the issue of always promoting Tux (and the not really freedom oriented Linux kernel) instead of free software with mascots like the GNU head.

Especially the supertux thing makes me sad, as I would love to see something like it again, but with a better direction and philosophy, which is why I wish the Hyperbola community/users would do (more?) libre game development (perhaps targeting a retro game console emulator and native). I am personally also interested in game development (Otherwise I probably would have never had the software-related knowledge I have now), though I don't have any real experience, except for knowing a bit of how to use C and C++ and a little bit of OpenGL.

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

About "supertux": Hyperbolas version in the newest testing-repositories is no longer supporting non-free services. wink
Just to mention: When we see that or it is shown to us, we remove it ... either directly via patching and configuration or in the last possibility we remove the whole package. That's why we are so strict about it: Another one gone is astromenace. I loved this one, but it is not clear licensed from its datafiles. So it had to be removed.

I have therefore listed supertux now as "staled package" for Hyperbola from now on (reasoning the Discord-integration).

https://wiki.hyperbola.info/doku.php?id … e_packages

Generic also: Hyperbola is as project oriented only towards the operating-system. It would give more issues if we start supporting a special platform or hardware as most of them are having issues. So we target only generic. Rest is always up to the community. wink

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

19 (edited by Curoh 2023-10-19 19:22:58)

Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

You can leave the supertux package alone. That integration not enabled anyways. I was just telling you why I don't like it anymore. The development and decisions are also at least partially done on Discord from what I read. And I've also read the developers tell someone to just keep in the loop and join the discord server to someone that was disagreeing with decisions they made on Discord (At least I interpreted it this way, maybe I misinterpreted it). Yes I know I'm not involved so perhaps I'm misjudging it. This is just why I've not been a fan anymore.
The Discord integration in Supertux is disabled by default anyways. It just completely misses the point of free software for me. Supertux is also available on Steam for some reason. (These are not issues for you, I know, it just makes me really unhappy with it.) EDIT: It is enabled in their official binary releases though which is what I was talking about. Doesn't require non-free libs though. It just doesn't exactly give me a good feeling when free software includes support for non-free software. (I'm glad Hyperbola (like the default) has it disabled.)

Yes I know that Hyperbola is as a project only oriented towards the operating system.
I asked the other things since you are also the community coordinator and hoped you could tell me more about whether there are any libre game development efforts or any kind of other efforts inside the community (or the system development) that would accept help, since I was interested in assisting if there are. (Since it's not really possible for me to contribute to most projects I find, because they are often on non-free services like Github or do their development and community involvement via non-free services like Discord. Like for example supertux). Besides that, are there any events where I could meet some of the community. I'm sorry for annoying you if I am, it's just that seeing all the positivity and strict principles on this forum makes me feel motivated that I also want to contribute in some way or another. If there is any way to help and promote free software for me, please tell me. Should I create a new thread somewhere in the Community section on the forum asking about this? I already checked there but didn't find what I was looking for.

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

For the moment I could alone point on some places, but perhaps you know them already? Like: https://libregamewiki.org/Main_Page
There are bunch of free, libre games in the making or further developing. Some for sure not fully oriented any longer there, as you have already described and that's the reasoning for me patching that Discord-integration out. In our package it is even no longer part of the menu, while not being enabled for sure.

That is what I meant: When we see some non-free or semi-free parts we either patch them fully out, ask upstream for configuration-options when not seen or ... at last remove it as package.

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

No I don't know about these places, that's why I was asking for recommendations. (Thanks for the recommendation.)
I came here for the operating system but after reading some forum threads and the wiki I loved the attitude.
I'm terrible at searching for things like this, so I was glad to have found a project here which supports all my requirements. Since Hyperbola is pretty strict with its principles, I thought asking here was a good idea. Since you seem to be experienced in this kind of community I wanted to know where to meet more people with strict principles like the people here. Please understand that I am absolutely terrible at everything social and I was asking for help on how to support the project and its philosophy. Sorry if it seemed unfitting.

I absolutely love the operating system though, just wish I could run it on all my devices. (But I can't because of non-free firmware.)

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Hyperbola is always for people searching on having the full control of their hardware and their system. But also for searching of information, may it be most technical but also for a warm and comfy place for all in search of a peaceful life. Kind of a mood included within the roots of the project. Kind of within the community itself. May it look most calm, even stale at some points. But everyone in search for information is getting a warm welcome here. Doing what is possible about that. And preserving things for sure. So? Feel welcome, make yourself a digital home and thanks all already you have done and shared. That helped for sure. smile

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Thanks, that is nice to hear.
Well anyways, for now I think I know what I need to know. (Links were helpful, many thanks.)
I guess I'll post a new thread whenever I have another issue or reply to one when I feel I can help with something.

As a last side-note: While I was using the system I didn't find a replacement in the repos for a piece of software I usually use. Just a minor issue for me (since I can just do it manually), but I didn't find a standalone graphical screen/monitor configuration utility (xrandr gui) with the drag-and-drop functionality of arandr (which I usually use on Devuan). If there is anything similar in the repos that replaces arandr please let me know.

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Re: First impressions (and questions) from a new user

Oh for this you could tryout lxrandr. But thanks for mentioning the other one! smile
I look into it.

Human being in favor with clear principles and so also for freedom in soft- and hardware!

Certainly anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities has the power to make you commit injustices: For a life of every being full with peace and kindness, including diversity and freedom. Capitalism is destroying our minds, the planet itself and the universe in the end!